I suspect this may well be contentious - but....
I usually used barbed hooks for most of my fishing, I lose a few fish, but not generally through hook slippage or hook pull- I have never known a barbed hook to cause significant damage to a fishes mouth when the fish is looked after properly and the hook removed correctly (although I am certain that at one stage or another we've all seen someone make a botch of it).
I fished at lakemore last week and caught quite a few carp and one cat - the carp on the whole were tiny - less than 5lb but I did get two good doubles, neither of which appeared to have been caught recently - the mirror had very much a parrot mouth which I suspect was from repeated capture when smaller - the fish was 17.5lb and really did lack the sides of its mouth. None of the smaller carp showed any signs of damage but I understand that they have only been recently introduced.
I did loose a number of fish - which was inevitable due tot he amount of weed in the lake - the fish had only to move 12" to be completely weeded - of course the loss was guaranteed due to the compulsory use of barbless hooks.
Anyway the cat that I caught - while small - graphically illustrates the issues that arise with barbless hooks that are prone to movement and slippage - opening wide holes in the fishes mouths or worse -
On the pic you can see where the original hook hold was in the corner of the mouth, it slipped during the fight to the cheek, before slipping again and finally hooking the fish in the top of the head.
carl
Hi lophius,
Classic!! I sincerely hope you showed that to the fishery owner for his education. There are far too many fishery owners insisting on barbless hooks. They believe that because a hook has no barb it does less damage, trouble is they won't be told otherwise, sheer ignorance. When you play a fish the tension on the line is changing all the time, this allows a barbless hook to move in and out of the original hole, very often creating more than one hole or making the original hole a lot bigger than it should be. A barbed hook will stay put.
I would strongly suggest that if you didn't show the owner at the time, you now send him the photograph with an explanation.
Regards,
Maurice
Am with you both on this. I never use barbless hooks for this precise reason. The banning of barbless hooks is one of the very good steps that Cemex have introduced on their waters to protect their fish. It is a shame that not all fishery owners are as enlightened. One of the worse waters i have ever come acrooss in terms of mouth damage to the fish is Drayton Reservior, barbless hooks combined with poor care by matchmen (motivated by money not fish care) has led to the fish being in an absolutley terrible state.
Before anyone jumps down my throat, yes barbed hooks can cause some problems when in the hands of inexperienced anglers (easily solved by education and by example). However the best angler in the world cannot stop barbless hooks causing severe damage, including blinding, as they slip far to easily and move around causing large holes in the fishes mouth.
I believe this has been studied in some detail at Sparsholt College, with the result being that there is a far greater potential for damage using barbless hooks.
A lot of fishery owners only account for the initial entry of the hook and do not take into account the potential for a hook slipping. Obviously a barbless hook will do less damage on it's first entry but has a greater potential to slip and cause further damage. Hooks slipping is less likely with a barbed hook.
Personally I believe that part of the problem is that some anglers do not take time to care for there catch and are far more interested in the next fish. For this reason, some anglers do not kow how to remove a hook whilst minimise damage to the fish. I have seen a number of tench at a local lake with missing lips. This is not as a result of barbed or barbless hooks, but merely the fact that a so called carp angler has not caught his target species and either winches the fish in or simply tugs at the hook/hookling in order to remove the hook.
There is a far bit of eductaion needed, not just for fishery owners but to all those that are new to the sport as well.
I agree with you whole heartedly but having said that BRING BARBLESS SATURDAY as Mick won't have barbed hooks.
Eric are pinched down barbs ok? i normally fish circle hooks and have never found any barbless ones.
yes all mine started out barbed. Its just he is having a purge on hooks lately last week he pulled an umbrella out of the corner of the lake and amongst other things snagged on it was a double treble barbed rig so he is not amused. You can't blame him really.
No you can't. There is no excuse for using treble hooks at all.
Circle hooks were developed as long line hooks, which is why they are all barbed. I'm suprised with the increased popularity of the hooks that nobody does a barbless version these days. Wherever needed i crimp the barb right down. Another thing that suprises me is that the carp boys havent got onto light circles for pop-ups and zig rigs, i think they would work a treat.
"light circles for pop-ups and zig rigs"
They do work brilliantly - I got some tiny ones from the states - well size 4's - the thing is that with normal bolt style rigs circles aren't really needed.
I can't believe that anyone would use trebles while catting -- especially on such a popular day ticket water - this is where checks by fishery owners AND by anglers comes in.
We're back to my argument for strict and proper enforcement.
with regard to barbless - I think there are many useful points here - and of course it is the initial penetration that most fish owners are interested in - although compare a pin prick or stab wound to a long cutting tearing wound - education is the key - both of anglers and fishery owners - of course the 'idea' of barbless hooks appeals much more to the moderates !!!
education is the key - both of anglers and fishery owners
-lophius
Precisely! But you haven't told us whether you "educated" the fishery owner at Lakemore by showing him that fish.
No I didn't maurice - I didn't actually see him until i was leaving and then it was a brief exchange where I complained about the weed, lack of fish, size of fish at a 'premier' fishery, etc etc ...don't think he was too impressed - also I'd not looked at the photos then - I think it may be worth sending the photos to him, although i didn't get a response last time I emailed him.
I think there are many other fishery owners that could do with seeing the evidence though.
Well fellas I will chip in here and say I am in total and utter agreement. Barbless hooks really are the greatest con in fishing. If I am on a water that states barbless hooks I pich my barbs down to the minimum needed so it still retains some shape to it. The owner hooks i use have the cutting point shape to them which even when pinched down helps to retain some sort of hold but I really dont like barbless hooks. Even barbless trebles can slip, the freshwater shark I took in India came in with the treble in the top of it head and the line wrapped around its head. I actually felt it slip half way through the fight. Its time fishery owners got some kind of education on this matter, but while the carp brigade still hold sway over most of the countries premier venues I doubt we will see a change. If the big name venues change there thought process, I am sure we would see more and more venues follow suit.
As i put earlier, cemex have banned barbless hooks, hopefully others will follow suit. The trouble is fishery ownership and common sense do not always go hand in hand.
So very tru my friend. Like I said, the carp brigade have so much financial say in what the trends are on waters, and untill they start sharing this vue we dont stand a chance.
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